Now that Commodore has arisen from the depths of obscurity like Cthulhu awoken from R’lyeh, the question on every shoggoth’s squamose lips is this: “Will there be a new Commodore Amiga?” The New Commodore is reportedly interested, but as [The Retro Shack] reports in the video embedded below, it might be some time before the stars align.
He follows the tortured history of the Amiga brand from its origins with Hi-Toro, the Commodore acquisition and subsequent Atari lawsuit, and the post-Commodore afterlife of the Amiga trademark. Yes, Amiga had a life after Commodore, and that’s the tl;dr here: Commodore might be back, but it does not own the Amiga IP.
If you’re wondering who does, you’re not the only one. Cloanto now claims the name and most of Amiga’s IP, though it remains at loggerheads with Hyperion, the distributors of AmigaOS 4. If you haven’t heard of them, Cloanto is not an elder god, but in fact the group behind Amiga Forever. They have been great stewards of the Amiga heritage over the decades. Any “new” Amiga is going to need the people at Cloanto on board, one way or another. That doesn’t mean it’s impossible– the new Commodore might be able to seduce Cloanto into a merger, or even just a licensing agreement to use the name on reproduction or new hardware.
While a replica C=64 was a no-brainer for the revived Commodore brand, it’s not quite so clear what they should do with the Amiga name. An FPGA reproduction of the popular A500 or A1200? Would anyone want newly-made 68000-based machines, or to follow Hyperion and MorphOS to now-outdated generations of PowerPC? All of these have been proposed and argued over for years.
We’d love to see something fully new that captures the spirit of the bouncing ball, but it’s hard to imagine bottling magic like that in the twenty-first century. For now, Amiga lies dreaming– but that is not dead which can eternally lie, and we hold out hope this Great Old One can return when the stars are right.
There are a lot of new Amiga HW, both in PowerPC and FPGA`s
There is, but it’s scattered, and with few exceptions, it’s not evolving. And yeah, I’m good friends with both Trevor Dickinson and the Vampire/Apollo guys, the two most successful at this.
It’s not at all likely that New Commodore is going to go after Amiga tomorrow. Amiga’s more of a mess than Commodore was, legally speaking, and even given the work done on it by others — very much not trivial by any means, and in fact, I have quite of few of those systems here — it will be far more expensive to properly support.
I’d love to see it all brought under a single software development that enables anyone to work on hardware and use the Amiga name. I’d also love a house by the beach… oh, wait, I have that. Two of them actually. Sometimes dreams do come true. I have a good reason to think that’s happening now for the classic Commodore fans. Let them have their day on a beautiful beach… they’re not your enemy.
I don’t understand the nostalgia trend. I loved my Amigas and I learned a heap of stuff about software development on them as a teenager. I have fond memories of making incredible stuff with them.
And also, I have moved on, grieved, and grown.
I’m tired of seeing old familiar names of my childhood dredged up and repackaged again and again. If someone wants to build replica hardware or an emulator in a box, that’s cool, but let’s not kid ourselves with promises of a grand revival of dubious purpose.
Make something new! Remember the ways these classic systems sparked joy for you and express them in a new form. Create something delightfully quirky for the next generation to fall in love with.
I don’t need a new Amiga. Not when there are so many other possibilities to explore.
this!!
Plus its’s still the old copyright crap about , using the C- logo to generate $$$$, I congratulate efforts like from Olimex ! Not only modern-rertro systems like AgonLight, but also affordable (that was the spirit of ol’ Commodore , remember??) and the most important Open Source Hardware !!! SO far copyright only harm done to the Amiga – sorry I wont pay a damn dime to the new commodore to ask permission to use their ‘roms’ whatever in order to feed their lifestyle.
I agree, those of us that had those systems when they first came out mostly have fond memories of them, but the reality is technology has moved on so much that you can’t recapture that time. It isn’t possible to develop a new system based on an old one that is able to compete with the capabilities of today’s computers.
The majority of these revivals end up being a fun distraction for a brief period, then put in the closet to be forgotten about.
Benefit of old systems is lessons to learn from. Right now the new presents a lot, but they also left a lot behind in the name of economic progress.
I’m mixed on this, I get restoring an old system, it’s like re-building an old car. I don’t see it the same way to buy a new system, that would be like buying a newly built 59 chevy or something. Not the same feeling to me. But then there those that build and like replica’s, which I don’t hate either.
It’s not for everyone, and isn’t meant to compete with new. It’s all for nostalgia, and that means different things to different people.
For hardware folks like, I guess you, and definitely me, building the new system is exactly like building that ’59 Chevy, or in my case, my old ’61 Thunderbird back in college.
But it’s not that simple, because there are also the folks who build on software. They probably don’t know all that much about what’s in the box, just how it behaves — the classic black box thing. So for those still in that zone, maybe the new C64 is a better C64 while still, from their software viewpoint, also exactly the same, and yet, connected to the internet, working on a modern monitor/TV, etc.
And yeah, I’ve talked to Christian (Peri) and I’m kind of happy about what I’ve heard. He has some good ideas, and they’re not entirely about the past. Their new C64 model, at $300, it like $96 in 1984 dollars… it’s not a major expense. That was the big problem I had with retro-Amigas: you can’t build small volume hardware cheaply enough to make it make any sense.
back then the amiga was cutting edge for the price point, and you could do things no other computer could at the time. Thus why it was so good.
But I don’t know why anyone wants to go back, our pc’s today are so much MORE usable than amiga was then. If you want that small system programming fun – I agree it is – boot up your c++ compiler and write programs for the esp32 or something else with an embedded RTOS..
Another, less popular point of view: It was cutting-edge from 1985 to 1987,
then VGA, Sharp X68000 and Acorn Archimedes hit the scene.
By the time A500 and A2000 were released, the Amiga’s star was sinking already.
By 1990, it was technologically obsolete. Then died silently past 1994.
Bull$h!t
I’m not going to be coding on a C64 any time soon. But I do understand it.
One reason: the C64 specifically, and the 8-bit era in general, was the last time a single person could understand every little thing about their computer: all of the ROM code, all of the features and quirks of the chipset, etc.
In fact, when we (yeah, I’m that Dave) made the C128, we came to understand that the software included in the system was effectively part of the hardware description. Even changing the character ROM font broke programs on the C64… so the C128 has one font for C128 mode and one for C64 mode!
Back when the C64 launched in 1982, most people who bought home/personal computers bought them to “do computers.” The computer was the destination, not the vehicle to enable other things. When the last C64 was sold, computers had completely changed to being that vehicle, including the C64. You bought them to play games, to write, to design computer systems (I just finished up my work day, around 3am, and then only because our hardware server was screwed up and not letting me log in), etc.
Some folks still want to “do computers” as a hobby, and the C64 or something similar fills that need.
I mean, don’t any of you all have hobbies? If you’re into photography, maybe you use a professional camera, but probably not a Phase One. But most of y’all probably just use a smartphnone, even if you know photography well enough to understand composition and get a great shot. If you’re into music, you may have a nice guitar, but you probably don’t have dozens, probably don’t have all the best (I do have a beautiful Rainsong WS1000-BI… but I bought my 12-string Ibanez for $50 at a flea market). You use what you like, what you can afford, what you find comfortable, and especially, what “fits your brain”… think about it.
Yes, you could use an average laptop for professional software development today in many areas (not every kind of software… try running a dozen VMs on a basic Best Buy special). But does that lead to an interesting hobby in coding easy, one person projects? Or did you buy it, like I did, to run Photoshop/Lightroom, Altium, REAPER, etc? That’s a different hobby that the folks who bought those C64s!
There’s a “Commodore” in Italy that doesn’t do retro, claims it “innovates” new and exciting things for the modern age. I.e. rebadges shitty made in china laptops and tablets.
“I don’t understand the nostalgia trend.”
I do. Older people now have enough money to relive their youth.
Some need the original hardware, often restoring it using modern devices to replace out of production custom ICs or to add features (HDMI output), those devices often being capable of emulating the entire C64 or Amiga at many times its native speed if applied to that task. They may have original peripherals that require this route.
Others can be satisfied with machines that merely look like the original hardware with the actual functions of the machine emulated by the aforementioned modern hardware.
Others don’t even need that and use an emulator on a PC or a dedicated SBC.
On this old Raspberry Pi, Sysinfo showed the Amiga emulation to be 246 times as fast as an A600 and 7 times as fast as an A4000 with a 25 MHz 68040:
Is the Raspberry Pi the best Amiga available?
Aug 11, 2017
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HZXM6cLVUg
As I understand it, the new C64 is not an emulation. It’s real hardware in an FPGA, sure. That’s a new implementation, but it’s still real hardware. That’s going to matter in a system as simple as the C64, versus a complex system with real OS like Amiga.
I’ll admit, I have a bunch of post-Commodore Amiga systems, but I’ve also run AmigaOS via emulation on workstation-class PCs. I’ve had 16-core PCs since 2019, and in fact, most of that’s for my hobbies, not strictly mandated for computer design. The professional GPUs I have are for the 3D CAD aspects of work… they’re slower than decent gaming GPUs these days. We all get to pick what does our work and fun best, eh? No need to assume someone buying the new C64 is confused or… wrong.
Mine will arrive sometime this fall… I won’t likely be programming on it, but I want to know what’s going on, and I did agree to be a technical advisor to the new company, what ever value I can lend. Now, if they decide to make a new C128, I might be a bit more involved!
I don’t believe nostalgia can fully explain the trend. If it was only nostalgia, then nobody younger than the machines would be interested in them, which (while a minority) is not the case.
But I don’t think these people are interested in a brand revival either.
Alternatives to the trinity (Apple, Microsoft, Linux). Especially considering the behavior of the first two, and the “year of…” the last.
You can totally wax nostalgic for a time you never lived in yourself. Its called anemoia.
Interesting concept, thanks for the info! ^^
There’s one catch, though: The C64 can be re-lived the way it really was, with your own memories.
Feelings of nostalgia/anemonia about distant times are a bit different, I think.
Tales of living in medival ages are likely being rose colored, maybe.
About pretty dressed people living in fary tale castles,
stories about gentle knights fighting dragons and saving princesses and so on.
“Tales of living in medival ages are likely being rose colored, maybe.”
As are tales of living in the 1960s despite you being able to buy bellbottoms and tiedye today.
Tales of living in the 80s or 90s are no different. Those of us who lived then can rose color our memories.
The distance of time doesnt matter to nostalgia/Anemoia.
Its still Anemoia if your too young to have been then.
PS. Castles, knights and princesses existed in medieval times, But when you start adding in dragons youve left nostalgia/Anemoia and entered fantasy escapism.
I for one liked the 90s and was a bit sad when it passed away.
At the time, I mean. Not in retrospect. I loved the optimism of the decade.
Thus, it’s not about rose colored memories to me, at all.
I had been there, I have recordings on VHS and photos that support my memories.
My memories aren’t fooling me.
Likewise, there are many people out there who have a direct connection to other eras.
Some have family members that are older than them,
who are the living manifestation of another time.
That being said, I’m afraid it’s not really possible to discuss these things rationally.
There are always people who argue that the past must be rose colored
and not possible any better than the current times we are living through.
It’s kind of interesting, though, that so many hold on to the 1970s to 1990s, no matter their generation.
Something must have been special about this time, thus, objectively speaking.
Maybe it way a healthy balance of real life vs technology? I don’t know.
Maybe it’s just because the current days are simply feeling exceptionally bad, so that any other era feels better?
Again, I don’t know.
“PS. Castles, knights and princesses existed in medieval times, But when you start adding in dragons youve left nostalgia/Anemoia and entered fantasy escapism.”
Good point, but didn’t dragon tales exist in medival times?
Back in the day, magic and phantasy were reak to people, maybe? 🤷♂️
I wasn’t there, so I don’t know for sure. Just wondering.
Yup.
I have a sister who is Beatles crazy. She was 7 years old when the broke up. She’s also a fantastic musician and she’s held “Beatles” parties, where everyone plays Beatles songs (and yeah, all those stupid B7 chords included).
The Beatles were gone about a year after her first piano lesson, but their influence wasn’t. In fact, we still have modern musicians influenced by the Beatles.
I jumped from the Commodore 8-bit only three years after I started working at Commodore, and I didn’t have a long Commodore 8-bit investment. A bit of nostalgia — the first personal computer I had regular access to was my friend Scott’s PET 2001 in 1977. When I go to the occaisonal Amiga computer show (AMIGA40 in Germany this October!), I’m still surrounded by folks who love the system, who see that system as launching their careers, maybe in a computer related field, maybe in music, maybe in video… it kind of hits me at all points. They know what they’re using today, just like me designing computers on my 16+ core PCs, but they also know where they came from, and feel good about that.
As professionals, if they buy into that, it’s nostalgia. As hobbyists, though, maybe not … maybe that’s a thing they want to play with. I had digital cameras back when I added a Canon 7 and Canon P to my collection of really old LTM (Leica Thread Mount) cameras and did some projects entirely on film. I do still have the Canon IVsb, though I sold the other two and the Leica IIIc. On another photo project, in 2019, I bought a Fujifilm X-Pro1 and a handful of Chinese lenses, fully manual, using old Zeiss optical forumla. Some of it was fun, some of it was the challenge of creating images that look less “digital” even when made with digital gear.
Some of this might even just be disconnection. If you’re any kind of engineer or artist, you’ve found yourself “in the zone” where time becomes unimportant and the creative forces just take over… hmm, it’s nearly 4:30am, I might be in the zone. That’s not always so easy to do these days: my pocket computer still foolishly called a “phone”, my watch — also a computer many times more powerful than a C64 and probably every Amiga — my ultra powerful desktop PC, also always connected, always bothering me. That’s one reason to work late into the night … no distractions. But some of y’all need sleep, I hear.
Sometimes I just want to pick up an accoustic guitar and play for the squirrels and lizards out in the woods, detached from everyone else. Sometimes I grab just that Fujifilm or some other limited camera and work with what I got while I’m out wandering, particulalry in a town I can get lost in. Sometimes, some folks just want the purity of that computer that they understand entirely, every register, every line of code. Maybe not for you, maybe not for me, but why not celebrate that these guys have a new option now?
I don´t need a new Amiga either. What is need is a highly modular, extensible, massively parallel / many cores platform based for example on RISC-V , with tensors.
Like a modern offspring of the transputer, with PCIe like interconnect lanes, that can break the hegemony of Nvidia and CUDA
Massive number of cores, massive memory, massive memory bandwidth.
All expensive.
But then again, the C64 ticked cheap, massive ram, and bandwidth (in doubling ram bandwidth to enable graphics run from the same ram).
Sadly I don’t think we’re likely to see innovation like that again.
My guess: History unfolded differently and was less rosy, less hopeful than some of us had hoped for.
Such as the smartphone, streaming, software as a service, bleakness in daily life.
Therefore, some long for a future that never came.
Today’s technology is both very advanced and very closed.
We have modules and highly advanced “black boxes”, so to speak, whose inner workings are only vaguely understood.
In stark contrast to this are the achievements of our youth from a time
when people still picked up soldering irons themselves,
even in groups and together, tinkered with their favorite devices, coded for fun (demoscene etc).
In addition, things back then were “close” and tangible.
That, at least, is my attempt at an explanation.
I’m not exactly talking about myself here, as I can’t exactly claim to be a die-hard Commodore fan.
Not everybody thinks the same way as you do
Everything is new again to the young. If they wish to keep it alive, I’m all for it. Like old dudes I know who love Model T’s. They have good memories of riding them when they were younger. It’s fun for a special occasion, but no longer a daily driver. Young people who appreciate history go nuts for them and the old guard enjoys teaching them about how to work on them, but each crowd has different reasons for keeping them around. “Let no man look down upon your youth.”
Commodore died in the 90’s and it’s mostly the fond memory of the related period that remains, many people cherish that, it’s called retro computing.
I own several C64 computers, good old cool retro stuff. But now that Commodore is in the process of being resurrected and new “official” C64’s are about to be released. My good old official Commodore retro C64 will suddenly be nothing more than just another “old” C64.
The fun thing of retro computing was that that old stuff from the 80’s and 90’s has reached a steady state of oldness, now suddenly, old things are getting older.
There is more than gaming, though.
There’s demoscene and music MOD music (tracker), SID tunes..
Or artists using D-Paint for pixel art.
Another term is vintage computing, by the way.
“Retro” is more of a fad, a trend of looking back on something.
A retro console is a remake (A500 mini is retro), while a vintage console is the real old console.
That’s one way to see it.
Personally, I’ve simply never stopped using certaing things from the past.
Software such as Winamp, MOD4Win, DOS 6.2x, Quick Basic 4.5, for example.
Or my FM radio (pocket radio). Still use vintage shortwave radios, too.
There’s even an 80s thermal paper fax machine that I’m still using in daily life. It’s not retro to me, at all.
Speaking of the C64, it’s nice as a RTTY terminal. I can use it to read weather news on shortwave with it.
Another useful task is using it as an cheap EPROM programmer.
There’s that DELA EPROMMER II for module port, for example.
Other users in the BBS hobby use the C64 as a PETSCII terminal and have fun going “on-line”.
Commodore has essentially become immortal. Anything that can fit on a Micro ATX motherboard can now be placed in a Commodore bread bin.
why? the brand died a long time ago. as a previous commodore system owner, user, service repair and programmer. i hate to say this but its time is done and unless you can really compete with this current industry and not charge the same prices as equipment available today, it will die again. They have to create an ecco system just like apple and i dont think this new team has the know-how. just like the other commodore owners they wont listen to the users new and old. You have to create an ecco system you must go above, beyond and not worry about the financials which what the old owners did. When steve jobs come back to apple that was what he did and at that time apple was almost going to file for bankruptcy. You have to have that umf and if you dont you go broke. Ask intel, ibm, and hp that did not want to think outside the box. Its not just enough to love the system and want to see it go on. You have put money and time for new and improved products.
Commodore computers are the thing of the past and only us oldies will use it. in business that not enough you need to bring in the new users to turn a profit and the new user have iphones. Also, let not forget the emulation (which is what i do for cheap). Also, another thing what destroyed commodore software developers, piracy. I stop developing software because there was not money in it because of piracy. I left for pc, made private contracting software and made a ton. Why, do you think the precious commodore brand name holders sold current items.
As a business owner may self, what run though my mind everyday, competition competition. How to make my business better and don’t get left behind.
sorry i love commodore but their time is up……
It’s a try to change/correct path of history a bit?
To try to get things back on course?
Not a few seem to be unhappy or even depressed about noways life, so this idea isn’t too far fetched, maybe.
Is that all there is? If so, it would make even more sense that
a minority of people wish so desperately for a way out of the hamster wheel.
Is that this so-called “gatekeeping” everyone talks about these days? ;)
Seriously, though. I have the impression you were living under a rock in this regards.
You’re victim of a misconception, I think.
The C64 isn’t just a random old computers for people age 50+.
No, it has gained an iconic status meanwhile, it has become a symbol.
There’s even the term “Generation C64”, that is similar to “digital natives”.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_C64
Also: Young people into gaming also are aware of video game history, of course.
They may never have seen a C64 in real life, but they know it from the news on the internet, YouTube videos, in the news papers and TV documentaries.
They may also had run a copy of VICE from time to time, for sake of curiosity.
Or bought a C64DTV on a garage sale, fleamarket etc.
To walk on the paths of their parents and grandparents, so to say.
Here’s a video that explains why especially young people love old things.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dEJiQnotR8
Long story short, let’s think about this analogy:
If you grew up in a cage all your life, don’t you want to explore the outer world eventually?
Because that’s what tablets and smartphones are. They’re a box many of the young are being caught in.
They want to go beyond touching plates of glass, want to feel things in reality.
Here’s an idea: buy Apple and bring back the original Macintosh.
Hm. Is it even needed? There’s a not so small community for M68k and PPC Macintoshs that is being well.
And the original Macintosh had been cloned a few times, too.
It’s not as if it can’t be re-made in principle. Without help of Apple.
1:1 replacement chassis are sold for years, I think.
The electronics of the Mac’s logic board are off the shelf parts and publicly available.
Merely the automatic floppy drive and CRT are a bit harder to acquire these days..
B/w camping TVs might be suitable as donors for CRTs, but they’re a bit smaller.
Otherwise, the first Macintosh is very simple from an electronics point of view, it’s a basic 68000 system, with insufficient RAM and a dumb framebuffer.
The magic rather lies in the design and in the software.
The original Macintosh kind of sucked. The important thing is that concerned old and young codgers have this place to band together to keep anyone anywhere from having fun!
The future of Amiga, its is OS. A strong investment in a new modernized version should be a priority. Combining AmigaOS4, Morphos and AROS into a new OS “Workbench 5” as the base, making one version open source and a proprietary commercial version like Chrome/Chromium. Arm, X86 version should be updated alongside. A robust and powerfull DEVKIT for Workbench 5 should be developed and maintained. if the actual developers hand copyright holders, don’t what to come along. Make it from Aros only. accessible and powerfully new amigas should be based in more mainstream hardware, with a distinct amiga design. Powerfull ARM based Amiga Laptops and X86-64 Amiga computers, should be acessible and powerfull. the drivers whould be optimized for the machines in production for “Workbench 5” , talk with older and new software developers, to port modern versions of classic Amiga professional software . lightwhave, PageStream … etc… a modern browser is critical. Firefox, Chrome, or a up to specs version of Ibrowse
Amiga OS already is free through AROS, which is API compatible.
The 68k version is binary compatible, too and can be used
on the bigger platforms in a similar way to how Mac OS 9 could be used in “classic environment” on OS X.
No one needs Amiga OS 3.x and 4 anymore, really.
Except for nostalgia and a few buggy applications.
Just like nobody really needs Atari TOS anymore, since there is EmuTOS.
It’s just like that the majority of Amiga users don’t yet have realized what they have gained through AROS.
They still are focused on “official” Amiga OS so much. IMHO.
Thats the point , AROS is Opensource and Free. if Warp and AmigaOS Owners dont what to join. Then make a modern version of AMIGAOS from AROS. 64 bits, SMP , protected memory is already present in AROS, a Newer modernized and secure version , would make the diference. AmigaOS had features in 85 (preemprive multitasking ) that MacOS only could had after trashing Classic MacOS, and replace it with a complete new system based on unix. AmigaOS flexibility and speed ( Microkernel , Datatypes, devices , Libraries, Arexx. ..etc) can be updated and surpass modern OS. its a matter of investiment. AROS is the proof of that. macos, atary tos , dos/windows up to 95 ) where a joke compared to AmigaOS
I’d like to see a completed AAA system. I was so eager for this to be released. Granted it would be old tech by today’s standards. Bundle it with a modern Blitz or AMOS and see what people create.
I’ve heard that before… and as the only person to every design a AAA hardware system (the main board, not the chips) I have to suggest that’s kind of nuts. Don’t get me wrong… the Amiga community has been nuts since Commodore died, and often in the very, very best ways.
But AAA was such a jump, you’ll never be able to do anything with it in Classic AmigaOS, other than maybe run under emulation. Even copper lists won’t be fully compatible. And so much of it just never worked, and of what we had in chips, only some of that could even be tested due to a fairly tragic bug in the Andrea chip (the data output buffers never flipped to inputs or tri-stated, so none of the other chips could output to the chip bus.. I could go on… ).
And yet, without a full AAA software development, none of the new features get interesting. Yeah, I’ve always kind of secretly hoped that one of the folks who’s done “Amiga in FPGA” projects would have taken on AAA from the specs (which I put online in 1994-1995 much as possible) and, far as anyone cared, that would be AAA. But back then, no way to code for it that was any better than the various RTG solutions out.
For those not in the know, the Commodore Semiconductor Group started AAA in 1988, one of the first 64-bit graphics systems. It had chunky and planar graphics, up to 1280×1024 resolution, multiple pixel clocks on a line-by-line basis, 4-operand blitter but no 3D (that was the Hombre project), 8 audio channels at 16-bit with L/R panning per channel, a “floppy” interface good enough for quad density floppies, CD-ROM, and even the old ST506 hard drive, though no one woudl have bothered with that in the era of 20MB/s SCSI (yeah, that was fast back then!).
All that said, I understood when I was working on that we had a fundamental problem. Basically, Commodore’s “it’s one big chip” approach, from the orginal Amiga to AAA, was flawed unless it realy could be one big chip. We were moving from full custom, transistor level designs to high level synthesizable stuff — most of AAA was written in the M-Language — but the tight coupling between all chips was problematic. We couldn’t change just one of them.
That was changing. We were embracing PCI for that in the latter days… Hombre was using PCI and I had planned that for “Acutiator”, what might have been the architectural direction of the A5000-era systems, had C= lasted. But I pretty much knew it was over when new management came in, mid-1991, and cancelled the Amiga 3000+ (Pandora chips + DSP) and other on-going projects, basically just because the previous management had been developing them.
The point of reviving these old machines is nostalgia, sure. But it’s also to keep improving upon them and to keep the spirit alive. Bedroom coding took off in the 80’s and today’s indy games owe everything to these computers that allowed anyone to create. And the c64 and Amiga scenes are stronger than they’ve ever been today. People are still using the platforms and enjoying the limitations of the machines to create music, games and animation. For me, I actually use these machines daily. And for those that don’t .. there’s a phone or an iPad in your future I’m sure for those who don’t get it.
nothing is stopping bedroom coding, hell that was the selling point of the PI. That time period has past and you never needed a C64 or Amiga to do it once they left the lime light
I think the nostalgia isn’t for particular bit of computer hardware, it’s nostalgia for a time when your OS wasn’t surveilling you, selling your data and using it’s privileged position on your computer to show you ads and so on.
I think this is why the Raspberry Pi is doing as well as it is, and why so many people are creating variations of Raspberry Pis in 3D printed replica cases (be it PDP, Mac, NeXT cube, Commodore PET or even miniature beige boxen).
Absolutely. But that’s the fine detail that some may be missing when hearing about the C64 and new Commodore.
To my understanding, the guys behind it aren’t interested in just living in the past,
but bringing the past into the present and future!
The C64 is a symbol of hope and enthusiam and represents something that nowadays is lost in the eyes of these people.
That’s why the C64 enthusiasts around the globe do build new hardware, for example.
They’re want to integrate the good things of the past into the now.
That’s why they’re building accessories based on latest technology, also.
It’s more than plain nostalgia, it’s about bringing back enthusiam, dedication and so on.
Something that’s different to the everyday life.
And the C64 is the “friendly face” of it, so to say. Something a whole generation can identify with.
Or more than that, even. The C64 was/is popular among Baby Boomers, Generation X and beyond.
It’s something people seem to be deeply familiar, like the NES or original Gameboy. A bridge between generations, sort of.
Even if the youngest people may not be impressed by the graphics anymore, they see the C64 as a positive thing, at very least.
There’s no negative stigma or something, I mean.
Some of them may see it as a fashion symbol, simply.
Or as a prop out of Stranger Things or any other retro themed show.
Anyhow, it’s more than about old people living in the past.
That would be too simple of an explanation.
The popularity of the C64 in the media is exceptionally high and still increasing as time wents on.
I believe they have some idea for looking forward, not just resurrecting the past. It’s going to be a small operation for awhile, of course, and I hope they’re smart about it. And also, that they represent the Commodore community well. That’s a big reason I’m on-board as a technical advisor… they said all the right things, even as jaded as I’ve been hearing other promises for Commodore/Amiga thinsg for the last three decades.
I was just thinking take Apollo (Vampire) Computers 68080 CPU but get investors to make a Multicode ASIC version at below 5nm process and see how it performance. If there was an Commodore-Amiga alliance that could get the capital to do a low volume production or prototype. I think it was a mistake to ditch the 68k and go POWERPC. The Amiga was built on 68k.
There had been a window, back in the early-to-mid 1990s, when the PPC seemed to be the only CPU really being focused on personal computing other than the x86.
That said, I was in the position at Commodore in the early 1990s of thinking about that and making future plans. We were pretty sure that, within the Motorola line, the 68060 would be the end of the mainstream line. Our CSG fab had 1.5 micron CMOS and NMOS, and we had enough trouble making our Amiga chipset evolve. We were never going to be the CPU company. We also had a foot in the computer graphics industry, and they all wanted DEC/Samsung Alpha, simply because it was rendering 3D graphics faster than anyone in those days.
But I never trusted PPC, because Apple was involved. And I got to experience that firsthand. After Commodore failed, I did some consulting for Amiga Technologies (ESCOM), the company that bought the Commodore/Amiga assets. They were pushing a move to CPU-independent AmigaOS codebase and a new project to build an A500/A1200 class machine on PowerPC. We had found some good tech in odd places — not the PC mainstream. Then the hammer fell: ESCOM’s PC business had failed, and everything came down with it.
AmigaOS via Hyperion became tied to PPC after that, mostly I think because Hyperion has the contract for PPC and wasn’t legally permitted to port elsewhere. That said, I also understood that no “Amiga” was going to get competitive with Windows/MacOS/Linux machines any longer, there was just never enough money beind any of those efforts. There never will be.
But that wasn’t even necessary. 80% of all computer users are happy with their phones, happy on Chromebooks, etc. It’s actually easier to enable an OS that seems full function today than it’s been in a good two decades. We had a taste of that at PIOS/Metabox, with our set top boxes, basically livingroom Amigas with extra hardware for what you needed, like DVD and DVB…. in a hardware window within your main OS view, or fullscreen. Even easier today now that everything interesting in video is IPTV, not tied to hardware at all. But I digress.. maybe it’s bedtime.
At least Amiga was a real computer.
Not everybody thinks the same way, so here is my deal: many former Amiga users are still Amiga users. The reasoning behind why they are is a bit varied, but each person would have to describe their attachment to the Amiga over the past 40 years (39 years for myself). I was not a gamer but needed a computer for office use and had disliked the Command Line Interface since the 1970s and my PDP-11 use. The IBM and the Mac were beyond my price range (I was adverse to the IBM based on the 8088 and the DOS interface). I used the Amiga for office tasks until 2000. Since then, I continued with it, but not as a daily driver.
What is it they are back WITH? Let’s be clear with, that it is retro computers of 80’s design. Are they back for the retro people? Lets face it and be honest, those machines can’t be used for anything really useful these days.
I would be impressed if commodore would once again manufacture chips, perhaps arm licensed, and a brand new commodore os (not linux based) that beats it all. And it won’t happen.
Very nice mixing Commodore and Lovecraft, in the same sentence, how could I resist.