1

4 SELECT COMMITTEE TO INVESTIGATE THE

5 JANUARY 6TH ATTACK ON THE U.S. CAPITOL,

6 U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

7 WASHINGTON, D.C.

10

11 INTERVIEW OF: RACHEL CRADDOCK

12

13

14

15 Tuesday, May 24, 2022

16

17 Washington, D.C.

18

19

20 The interview in the above matter was held via Webex, commencing at 2:06 p.m.

21 Present: Representative Murphy.

 2

2 Appearances:

5 For the SELECT COMMITTEE TO INVESTIGATE

6 THE JANUARY 6TH ATTACK ON THE U.S. CAPITOL:

8 , SENIOR ADMINISTRATIVE ASSISTANT

9 , CHIEF CLERK

10 _ , INVESTIGATIVE COUNSEL

11 , INVESTIGATIVE COUNSEL

12 SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE COUNSEL

13

14 For RACHEL CRADDOCK:

15

16 DANIEL BENSON
 3

2 - We will go on the record.

3 It is 2:06 p.m.

4 Good afternoon. This is a transcribed interview conducted by the House Select

5 Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack on the U.S. Capitol, pursuant to House

6 Resolution 503.

7 Ms. Craddock, could you please state and spell your full name for the record?

8 Ms. Craddock. My name is Rachel Craddock, R-a-c-h-e-1, last name

9 C-r-a-d-d-o-c-k.

10 - Thankyou.

11 This will be a staff-led interview. Members of the select committee may choose

12 to join and ask questions. But as of now, they're not with us. But I do have with me an

13 investigative counsel named And I introduced myself before, but I'll say it

14 again for the record. My name i s - . I'm the Senior Investigative Counsel on

15 the staff for the select committee.

16 At this time I know you have Mr. Benson with you, but I'd ask him to please

17 announce himself and spell his name for the record.

18 Mr. Becker. All right. Daniel Benson, B-e-n-s-o-n, of Kasowitz Benson with the

19 witness, Rachel Craddock.

20 - Thank you, Mr. Benson.

21 Before we start, I'll go over just a few ground rules to make this go smoothly

22 today. And the first is just to let you know, you've already seen, is we have an official

23 reporter who's on who will record what're saying today and transcribe it.

24 So for the clarity of the record, I just ask that you wait until I or whoever else asks

25 the question finishes before you answer, and we'll wait for you to finish your answer
 4

1 before we ask our next question. Okay?

2 The other point that I'll make, having -- you having nodded your head, is that the

3 reporter cannot record nonverbal responses, such as shaking or nodding your head. So

4 if at any point in response you do that, excuse me in advance, but we'll ask you to say yes

5 or no.

6 Now all we're asking today is that you provide the best answer you can based on

7 your recollection of the events we'll talk about. If I ask a question or someone else asks

8 a question that's not clear, just let us know. And we'll do our best to rephrase it so that

9 it is clear. And if you don't know the answer or you don't remember, just say so.

10 If at any point you need a break, whether for comfort or to talk to Mr. Benson

11 privately, happy to accommodate that. Just let know and we'll go on mute and can turn

12 the cameras to off and just let us know when you're ready to come back.

13 Now, throughout the interview, I may show you an exhibit. And if I do, we'll just

14 flash it up on the screen. I sent them to Mr. Benson in advance yesterday. If so,

15 you've had a chance to look at them, that's great. Even if you did, if you need more time

16 to look at them, if they're on the screen, take whatever time you need to familiarize

17 yourself with them before you answer a question.

18 Also, I want to remind you, as we do any witness who meets with the select

19 committee, that it is unlawful to deliberately provide false information to Congress, and

20 that to do so could result in criminal penalties. So are you -- do you understand all of

21 that?

22 Ms. Craddock. Yes, I do.

23 - Do you have any questions before we get started?

24 Ms. Craddock. No questions.

25 - Okay. Great. When you leaned in just then, the audio was much
 5

1 better. I think, as you answer, it will be helpful if you do lean a little bit closer. That

2 will be -- that will work.

3 Now I do see that Mrs. Murphy, who's a member of the select committee, is

4 waiting to be let in. And I'll ask if the clerk or the staff monitor can let her in.

5 So for the record, Mrs. Murphy has joined us. Thank you for being here today.

6 - Ms. Craddock, as we get started, I just want to reflect for the record

7 that you're appearing here today voluntarily without the need for a subpoena. Is that

8 right?

9 Ms. Craddock. Yes, sir.

10 - So I reached out to you. And then you let me know that you were

11 retaining an attorney, and then Mr. Benson reached out to me. Is that right?

12 Ms. Craddock. Yes, sir.

13 Thank you for doing that.

14 EXAMINATION:

15 BY

16 Q Now how old are you?

17 A I am 28.

18 Q And what is your highest level of education?

19 A I have a bachelors in science.

20 Q When did you graduate?

21 A 2016.

22 Q What is your current occupation?

23 A My current occupation is an operations director for Affinity Partners.

24 Q Is it correct that you worked for lvanka Trump during her time in the White

25 House?
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1 A I did, yes, sir.

2 Q What year and month, to the best you can remember, did you start working

3 for Ms. Trump?

4 A It was early 2019. The exact month, I don't remember. And I was there

5 through 2021, the end of January.

6 Q Prior to that, taking that role, where were you working?

7 A I was also at the White House. I was in the press office.

8 Q Who were you reporting to in the press office?

9 A Sarah Sanders.

10 Q Could you say that again? I think the audio cut out.

11 A Sarah Sanders.

12 Q Now as of January 2021, when you left the White House, what was your job

13 title at that time? And what generally were your responsibilities?

14 A Special Assistant to the President was my job title. And my responsibilities

15 were mainly focused on operations, logistics, and touched on a few policy areas.

16 Q Operations and logistics with respect to what Ms. Trump was working on, or

17 did you have a broader portfolio?

18 A Just for lvanka's office.

19 Q And what were generally the policy prerogatives that you were working on

20 toward the end of 2020 and January of 2021?

21 A I worked on a lot of the COVID-19 relief efforts, such as the Farmers to

22 Families Food Box program.

23 Q Did you stay at the White House through the last day of President Trump's

24 administration, that is, January 20th? Was that yes?

25 A Yes. Sorry.
 7

1 Q That's okay.

2 Now where was your office space located on the White House grounds?

3 A In the West Wing on the second floor. There's a little cove that was next to

4 lvanka's office.

5 Q That answered my next question where her office was in relation to yours.

6 But within the office space that you had, did you have a TV?

7 A No.

8 Q Did Ms. Trump within her office space have a TV or TVs in the plural?

9 A There was one TV.

10 Q If you could, just situate us, because it might be relevant later. When you

11 walked into Ms. Trump's office, what was the layout as someone walking into it where,

12 you know, the TV was, where her desk was or wherever she would sit?

13 A So when you walk in, it's two -- kind of a two-part office. You walk in.

14 There was a conference table right when you walked in that sat about, I guess, eight to 10

15 people. I don't really remember.

16 And then you go to the -- you look to the left, and then there was a chair. And

17 then there was, like, a separate -- a wall separation. And that's where the TV was, kind

18 of behind that. And there was a couch in front of the TV. And then back in the corner

19 also on the left side of the room was where her computer/standing desk was.

20 Q So the -- in terms of your support for Ms. Trump, was there anyone else

21 working with you? I'm just focusing on the time of November 2020 to the end of

22 President Trump's administration.

23 A Do you mean staff-wise?

24 Q Yes.

25 A Yes. We had -- would you like me to list out everybody?

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1 Q Unless it's a long list. I don't know if it's just handful of people. How

2 many folks were there?

3 A We were a small, agile office. So the Chief of Staff was Julie Radford. And

4 then the policy team was Rosemary Lahasky and Stewart Young. And then we had Lynn

5 Kelly and Kathryn Walker and then myself.

6 Q I believe it was Ms. Mahasky, you said?

7 A Lahasky.

8 Q Could you spell that? Because that's the only the name that might not a

9 have a common spelling, if you know.

10 A L-a-h-a-s-k-y.

11 Q Did any of the people you just discussed share office space with Ms. Trump

12 within her office, or were they all situated outside somewhere within the White House

13 grounds?

14 A They were situated, besides Kathryn, were all situate -- actually, have a lot of

15 moves. So I should be clear.

16 Q Just in January.

17 A So in November through January, Rosemary Lahasky, Julie Radford, myself,

18 and Kathryn Walker were positioned on the second floor of the West Wing. Stewart

19 Young and Lynn Kelly were across the street in the executive -- EEOB is what we called it.

20 Q So I'll stop there to see if anybody has any questions just on Ms. Craddock's

21 background and role.

22 And I don't see that anyone does.

23 So I'm just going to go and talk and ask a few questions about the presidential

24 election in 2020. Okay. Ms. Craddock?

25 A Okay.
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1 Q And all the questions I'll ask are just to the best of your knowledge. And so,

2 to your knowledge, what, if any, involvement did Ms. Trump have in the efforts of

3 President Trump and those working on his behalf to challenge the results of the election?

4 A To the best of my knowledge, no participation.

5 Q Did Ms. Trump share with you her views about the efforts made by President

6 Trump and those working on his behalf to challenge the election results?

7 A She did not.

8 Q Did Ms. Trump ever express to you or share with you the view that she

9 believed the election was stolen?

10 A She did not.

11 Q Or that the election was a fraud?

12 A She did not.

13 Q Did Ms. Trump ever express to you that she believed President Trump had

14 lost the election?

15 A She did not.

16 Q Or that he should, that is, President Trump, concede the election to Joe

17 Biden?

18 A She did not.

19 Q Did Ms. Trump ever recount to you or share with you discussions that she

20 had with President Trump about whether he won or lost the election?

21 A She did not.

22 Q Did anyone else ever recount to you discussions that they had personally

23 with President Trump about whether he won or lost the election?

24 A To the best of my knowledge, no.

25 Q Now prior to January 6th of 2021, were you privy to any discussion among
 10

1 White House staff, Ms. Trump included, about Vice President Pence's role on January 6th

2 with respect to the certification of the vote?

3 A No, I was not privy, nor did I hear anything.

4 Q Now as -- the time we're talking about was within the pandemic, I know we

5 still are. But particularly back then, was your day-to-day in that timeframe, were you

6 coming to work as a general matter?

7 A Yes, every day, uh-huh.

8 Q And was Ms. Trump also coming to work every day as a general matter?

9 A She was, yes.

10 Q So now, turning to the rally at the Ellipse on January 6th, are you familiar

11 generally with the fact that the rally occurred and President Trump spoke there?

12 A Yes.

13 Q Do you recall how you first learned that President Trump would be speaking

14 at that rally?

15 A I believe it was a day or two before.

16 Q And how did you learn about it?

17 A Secret Service actually told me that there was an event, and I did not know

18 about it.

19 Q Did you have any discussions with Ms. Trump about the event before it took

20 place?

21 A I did not, no.

22 Q So were you aware of whether she was considering whether to speak at the

23 event?

24 A I was not aware of those -- I wasn't a part of any of the discussions.

25 Q Similarly, were you a part of any discussions about who else would be
 11

1 speaking at the event other than possibly Ms. Trump and the President?

2 A I did not, or I was not. Excuse me.

3 Q Prior to the event that is on January 6th or the day of, were you privy to any

4 discussions among White House staff, Ms. Trump included, about the potential for

5 violence on January 6th within Washington?

6 A No, I was not.

7 Q Now on the day of January 6th itself, were you at work that day?

8 A Yes.

9 Q Do you remember about what time you got to work?

10 A Between 9:00 and 10:00 a.m., a little later than normal.

11 Q Any reason you can remember about why you were running later that day?

12 A Just with it being an event, it's a little bit harder, traffic-wise, to get in.

13 Q Do you recall what, if anything, was on your schedule for the day? And

14 with respect to Ms. Trump, did she have meetings or any events that she was scheduled

15 to be at that day?

16 A I don't remember the exact meetings, but we did have items on the

17 schedule. I printed off a schedule card that morning.

18 Q Prior to that day, were you and your colleagues supporting Ms. Trump

19 involved in the transition effort between the Trump and the Biden administration?

20 A Actively, yes.

21 Q And when you say "actively," what does that mean?

22 A That day, we were working on memos. We were meeting with her about

23 the transition memos and, you know, preparing for that transition. It --

24 Q Is it fair to say -- I didn't mean to cut you off. Go ahead.

25 A It was a lot of work.

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1 Q So fair to say, as of January 6th, your expectation was that President Trump's

2 administration would end on January 20th and Joe Biden would be sworn in as president?

3 A Yes.

4 Q And how long had you been working actively on the transition effort?

5 A We started after Thanksgiving.

6 Q Now, you know, we know from various documents and testimony that

7 Ms. Trump was with President Trump the morning of January 6th, first in the residence,

8 and then in the Oval Office with other members of her family. Were you aware

9 generally that day that she was with her family and the President --

10 A Yes.

11 Q -- in the morning?

12 A Yeah.

13 Q Did you see her before she joined her family and her father?

14 A Yes.

15 Q And we're also aware generally that, while in the Oval Office, President

16 Trump called Vice President Pence that morning of the 6th to discuss the upcoming

17 certification of the election results in Congress, and that Ms. Trump was there in the Oval

18 Office when that call took place.

19 So I'll just ask this: Whether on January 6th or after, so through today, did

20 Ms. Trump ever recount with you the events of the morning of January 6th, what she

21 observed, being there with her father and her other family members?

22 A Not in detail. All she said was that it was a very intense call.

23 Q The call between the President and Vice President Pence?

24 A Yes.

25 Q And when do you remember her telling you about that call?
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1 A In the car on the way to the Ellipse.

2 Q All right. So I'll -- so you went to the Ellipse yourself with Ms. Trump?

3 A Yes.

4 Q Did anybody else go with the two of you from Ms. Trump's staff?

5 A Yes. Her Chief of Staff, Julie Radford.

6 Q And had it been your plan for you personally to attend the Ellipse rally

7 before January 6th? You knew you were going to go?

8 A No.

9 Q So why is it that you ended up going with her to the event?

10 A Just being the assistant and doing a lot of the operations and logistics, I

11 coordinated those fairly last minute with Secret Service, and ended up just jumping in to

12 go that morning.

13 Q You said you saw Ms. Trump before she went to see -- to meet with her

14 father and family that morning. Is that right?

15 A Uh-huh, yes.

16 Q And at that point did you already know you'd be going to the Ellipse rally

17 with her?

18 A No.

19 Q Did she tell you in advance of meeting with her father and family that

20 morning what she expected to happen that day?

21 A No, She did not.

22 Q And did you know whether or not she would be speaking at the event?

23 A I knew she was not speaking.

24 Q Did she tell you why she was not speaking?

25 A No.
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1 Q Do you remember during -- how is it that you -- just trying to go through how

2 you made your way to the Ellipse. How did you know it was time to leave?

3 A I had emailed that morning, asking where they were leaving from, what time

4 everyone, because I didn't have any details. None of us did. So I emailed that

5 morning, inquiring details. And that's when the decision to go was made.

6 Q Who did you email?

7 A Someone in the Advance office.

8 Q Do you remember who that was? So, for instance, we know that Jared

9 Small was, I believe, working on the event and also Max Miller.

10 A I think -- well, it was the person who did, like, the -- I think it was Ryan

11 McAvoy, I think.

12 Q And we know that, at least as compared to the schedule for the day's events,

13 President Trump ran behind in terms of getting to the Ellipse. Do you remember that it

14 was a later arrival than was planned?

15 A I didn't know the schedule, so no.

16 Q Okay. So then who told to you come down to get in the car, if you

17 remember?

18 A I came down to the car early and sat in the car. For how long, I don't know.

19 Q And Ms. Radford was with you as well?

20 A Yes.

21 Q So you sat in the car until Ms. Trump joined to you drive over to the Ellipse?

22 A Yes.

23 Q When Ms. Trump got in the car with you, did anybody else join her? Or

24 was it just her?

25 A Just her and her agent.

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1 Q And what, as best you can remember, what did she discuss with the two of

2 you in the car when she joined you?

3 A The only thing that was said, to my knowledge, was that there was a very

4 intense call between the President and the Vice President.

5 Q And intense in what way?

6 A She didn't go into detail.

7 Q What did Ms. Trump's mood appear to be like at that time as she was

8 describing the call?

9 A Upset.

10 Q Did you understand the call to have been about the joint session? Did she

11 at least say that much, it was about what Vice President Pence was going to do that day?

12 A No, she didn't go into any detail.

13 Q Did you or Ms. Radford ask her for more details about the call?

14 A I don't remember.

15 Q So a fairly quick trip to get to the Ellipse, I imagine, from the White House?

16 A Yes.

17 Q When you got to the Ellipse, can you just walk us through what you did

18 between the time you got there and when President Trump took the stage?

19 A We walked in, and they had white, tent-like structures set up. And it was

20 pretty brief. They had TVs in the back of that area. We were back there pretty briefly,

21 and then, at some point, he took the stage. And then we went to go find a warmer tent,

22 less crowded tent to be at.

23 Q Before President Trump took the stage, at any point that morning, had you

24 heard any discussion about President Trump's desire to go to the Capitol after he was

25 done speaking at the Ellipse?

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1 A I did not.

2 Q Now were you able to hear the President's speech from wherever you were,

3 getting warm, or in the tent that morning?

4 A I could hear it, yes.

5 Q Were you following it closely and listening to everything he was saying?

6 A No.

7 Q Did you hear, while the President was speaking, him say words to the effect

8 that he was going to go to the Capitol with the people who were there at the rally after

9 he was done speaking?

10 A I have no idea.

11 Q Have you since heard the fact that he said that during the speech? Are you

12 aware of that?

13 A No.

14 Q Did you stay at the Ellipse through the end of President Trump's speech?

15 A Yes.

16 Q And Ms. Trump stayed there as well?

17 A Yes.

18 Q And Ms. Radford?

19 A Yes.

20 Q So after the President was done speaking, what happened next?

21 A We briskly walked to the motorcade. Otherwise, you'd miss it.

22 Q So the three of you got back in the car together?

23 A Yes.

24 Q Did you have any interaction with President Trump or hear him interacting

25 with others before you got back in the motorcade?

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1 A I did not. We were in the cars before.

2 Q So from -- within the -- between the time you were at the Ellipse and getting

3 back in the car, did you have any further conversation with Ms. Trump or hear her talk

4 with others about the phone call between President Trump and Vice President Pence

5 earlier that morning?

6 A No.

7 Q Did you hear the President during his remarks talk about Vice President

8 Pence and his needs to have courage and to do the right thing during the joint session, in

9 his words?

10 A I did not.

11 Q When you got -- what did you do when you got back to the White House?

12 A I went straight to the Navy Mess to pick up lunch.

13 Q For you or for everybody?

14 A For the whole -- the whole group.

15 Q Okay. Did Ms. Trump come with you?

16 A No. It was a long line.

17 Q After you picked up lunch, where did you go?

18 A Straight back up to the office.

19 Q Approximately what time do you remember this being at? For instance, we

20 have records that show that President Trump arrived back at the White House roughly at,

21 you know, 1:20 p.m. Does that sound about when you would have gotten back?

22 A Actually, no, because I know I was trying to rush to -- I remember trying to

23 rush to place the Navy Mess order and the Navy Mess closes at 2:00 p.m.

24 Q In the motorcade, would President have gone first? Or did you go before

25 him? Do you remember?

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1 A Do you mean to get into the vehicles?

2 Q Or rather to travel in the vehicles, once you're in them and the vehicles

3 begin to move.

4 A His car's at the beginning of the motorcade.

5 Q So just before 2:00 o'clock is when the Navy Mess closes. So you got the

6 order in, in time to get the food?

7 A Yeah, a couple of minutes to spare.

8 Q At any time before you put the order in for food, did you become aware of

9 violence or a disturbance at the Capitol?

10 A No.

11 Q When did you first become aware, as best you can remember?

12 A Not until after we ate lunch.

13 Q Which would have been around what time, if you can remember?

14 A Sometime in the 2:00, probably the 2:00 to 2:30 window, just based on

15 when I probably picked up the food.

16 Q Did you eat together with Ms. Trump and others on her staff?

17 A No.

18 Q So you delivered the food to everybody, and then you went back to your

19 own desk?

20 A Yes.

21 Q And delivered food to Ms. Trump as well?

22 A Yes.

23 Q And at the time that you delivered food, do you remember whether or not

24 the TV was on in her office?

25 A I don't recall.
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1 Q As a general matter, would she have the TV on, on any given day when she

2 was in the office?

3 A It's very hit and miss.

4 Q So how is it that you came to learn about the violence? You're at your desk

5 eating, right?

6 A Her Chief of Staff had gone in, I mean, as she normally did, Julie Radford,

7 because we were working on, like, transition documents at that point. And she had

8 gone in, and the door was cracked. And I could hear Julie say something. And I don't

9 know what they were seeing in the room, but I knew Julie had, at one point, seen

10 something on the TV. When, I don't know. So the TV was on, and I heard the volume

11 of the TV go up. And that's all I really remember.

12 Q Okay. But that stands out in your mind because you knew at the time that

13 Ms. Radford was telling Ms. Trump about something was wrong at the Capitol?

14 A The door was cracked. Something -- when I heard the TV volume go up, I

15 could just, having worked for them for 2 years, I could just tell something was wrong.

16 Q So what did you do?

17 A I didn't move. I stayed at my desk.

18 Q All right. But this -- what you're describing is in response to my question

19 about how you learned that there was a disturbance or violence at the Capitol. So

20 between the time you hear Ms. Radford go into Ms. Trump's office and the volume on the

21 TV go up, how is it that you then come to know that something is actually wrong at the

22 Capitol?

23 A We started talking about social media. There was -- she wanted to put

24 something out and they asked for my input. And that's when I went into the room and

25 learned more about it, what was going on.

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1 Q When you say she wanted to put something out and wanted your input,

2 who's that?

3 A lvanka.

4 Q Did she come out and get you, or did Ms. Radford come out and get you?

5 A I just heard my name.

6 Q So you sat close enough you heard your name and you went in. And when

7 you went in, was the TV on and you could see the coverage of what was happening at the

8 Capitol?

9 A Yes.

10 Q And so what message did Ms. Trump at that time say she wanted to put out,

11 sum and substance? What did she want to say?

12 A You know, peaceful protesting is okay, but violence is never the answer.

13 mean, to the best of my knowledge, that's what I remember.

14 Q And what was the general -- the mood of the office at that point, seeing

15 what you were seeing on the TV and what was developing?

16 A I mean, we were pretty upset.

17 Q Was anyone else there in the office with you and Ms. Radford and

18 Ms. Trump at the time you're discussing this?

19 A No.

20 Q So what happened from that point forward?

21 A At some point, she went downstairs, and Julie and I stayed upstairs.

22 Q So Ms. Trump, that is, went downstairs?

23 A Yes.

24 Q Did she tell you why she was going downstairs?

25 A She didn't say.

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1 Q How soon after you went in the office did she leave to go downstairs?

2 A I don't remember.

3 Q Was it a matter of minutes, a half an hour, an hour?

4 A Probably 10 to 15 -- 10 minutes, maybe.

5 Q Did you have a sense of where she was going, that is, to go -- whether to see

6 her father or to go see other White House officials?

7 A My understanding, it was to the Oval.

8 Q And had anybody asked her to come down to the Oval, to your knowledge,

9 at that time?

10 A I don't remember.

11 Q How long was Ms. Trump gone until you saw her again? Do you

12 remember?

13 A I don't remember.

14 Q Had you-all -- had someone put out a statement on social media on

15 Ms. Trump before she left?

16 A It was agreed upon before she left, and it was put out right as she was gone.

17 Q Right as she was gone, in other words --

18 A She wasn't standing there.

19 Q Who posted it then to social media?

20 A I did.

21 Q So was it a tweet?

22 A Yes.

23 Q Having seen her Twitter, is this the tweet that mentioned American

24 patriots --

25 A Yes.
 22

1 Q -- and about the protests? All right.

2 Now this was at roughly 3:15 in the afternoon, after her father had tweeted. Do

3 you remember that it was close in time to a tweet by President Trump?

4 A I don't remember. I was only focused on hers.

5 Q And to your knowledge, when you went into the office, when you were

6 asked to come in, was that when Ms. Trump was first learning about the violence at the

7 Capitol from what you could observe?

8 A From what I could observe, I think so, yeah.

9 Q And you had come straight from the Navy Mess after getting the lunch up to

10 your office and had stayed there?

11 A The lunch? We --

12 Q Right.

13 A -- ordered lunch.

14 Q Right. But you had come up from the Navy Mess to your office, delivered

15 lunch, and stayed at your desk until you were called in to help with the tweet?

16 A To the best of my knowledge, that's what I remember.

17 Q Did you see anybody else go in or out of Ms. Trump's office other than

18 Ms. Radford during that time?

19 A Not at this exact moment, but there were people, one person in particular,

20 that did come up.

21 Q And who was that?

22 A Eric Herschmann.

23 Q That was before or after Ms. Radford went in the office and the TV volume

24 went up?

25 A It was after.
 23

1 Q And what do you remember about that with Mr. Herschmann coming in?

2 A I don't remember much.

3 Q So obviously, by this point -- not obviously -- had Ms. Trump come back

4 upstairs from wherever she had been in the Oval Office?

5 A I really -- I don't remember.

6 Q Why don't I start with this? What do you remember about your

7 interactions with Ms. Trump when you saw her next, after she had left to go to the Oval

8 Office?

9 A Very brief.

10 Q And what did she tell you at that time? What did you discuss?

11 A We didn't talk.

12 Q Did you ever ask her what was going on with the President and what was

13 being done to address the violence at the Capitol?

14 A I did not.

15 Q Did she, at any point that day, tell you about her discussions with her father

16 about what was going on at the Capitol?

17 A She did not.

18 Q Did she tell you about her discussions with anyone else within the White

19 House, whether Mark Meadows, Dan Scavino, you know, Pat Cipollone, anybody?

20 A She did not.

21 Q Did you hear her talking with other people about the violence at the Capitol?

22 A Not to my knowledge.

23 Q It's been reported, and we've gathered evidence that Ms. Trump met with

24 her father in the private dining room off the Oval Office, and at least had input into one of

25 the tweets he sent out that day.

 24

1 Did she ever talk to you about that, about giving input to her father about what to

2 say in his tweets about the violence?

3 A She did not, no.

4 Q Were you following or aware of what the President was tweeting that day on

5 social media?

6 A Not immediately, no.

7 Q But at some point that day you were aware of the things he'd been saying?

8 A Yes.

9 Q And were you aware, as the attack was ongoing at the Capitol, that various

10 people were saying that the President should, you know, make a statement or do a video

11 address of some sort to tell people to go home?

12 A Did you ask if I was aware of that?

13 Q Yes.

14 A Yes.

15 Q What, if any, discussions did you hear within the White House during this

16 time about if the President was going to make such an address, and if he was, what he

17 was going to say?

18 A I was not privy to any of those conversations.

19 Q Are you aware that eventually at 4:17 p.m. he did send out a tweet with a

20 video, telling people to go home?

21 A I saw the video on Twitter.

22 Q To your knowledge or, rather, did you speak to anybody within the White

23 House who was involved in the filming of that video, or drafting the remarks for the

24 President to give?

25 A No.
 25

1 Q To your knowledge, did Ms. Trump have anything to do with that video?

2 A To my knowledge, no.

3 Q Now going back to Mr. Herschmann coming up to Ms. Trump's office, again,

4 as best you can remember, what happened when he came up?

5 A I was not in the room. When he went into her office, I left the office.

6 Q Do you remember for how long -- oh, you said you left the office. Okay.

7 A It's -- I guess I should say it's a very small space. So when I say I leave the

8 office, I left. And the door was shut.

9 Q But this was after Ms. Trump had come back from visiting the Oval Office the

10 first time?

11 A I don't remember exactly when Eric came up. I'll be honest.

12 Q When Mr. Herschmann left, did Ms. Trump go with him or did he leave on

13 his own?

14 A I don't know. Eric was up there a lot that day.

15 Q When you say a lot, what does that mean?

16 A More than once.

17 Q Why was he up there so many times?

18 A I don't know. I wasn't a part of the conversations.

19 Q But given your proximity to the office, could you at least hear the general

20 tenor of the conversations and what was being discussed?

21 A No. I took it as a cue to leave my desk area.

22 Q We have, in the course of the investigation, learned that Mr. Herschmann

23 and possibly others within the White House, asked Ms. Trump to weigh in with her father

24 about what to say about the violence at the Capitol. Did you become aware that that

25 was the tenor of the discussions Mr. Herschmann was having or others with Ms. Trump
 26

1 that day, to get her to speak to her father?

2 A I heard about that after January 6th.

3 Q And how did you hear about that and from who?

4 A The press.

5 Q Did you ever ask Ms. Trump about that?

6 A No.

7 Q As you were monitoring the President's tweets, social media during the day,

8 did you have a reaction to whether what he was saying was sufficient to meet the

9 moment of what was happening at the Capitol?

10 A I mean, it was a pretty upsetting day. So I'm not -- to be honest with you, it

11 was just a really upsetting day. And I don't really remember having a feeling one way or

12 the other, other than just being, you know, upset about the situation.

13 Q Did you ever give advice to Ms. Trump that more needed to be done and

14 that she should speak to her father about that?

15 A No.

16 Q How about Ms. Radford? Were you discussing with her during that

17 afternoon of the 6th about what, if anything, more should be done in terms of the

18 President's statements?

19 A No.

20 Q What time do you remember leaving the White House that day? We know

21 that I think around 6:00 o'clock there was a curfew in the city and that a direction was

22 given at least to most staff to leave if they could. Is that right?

23 A I don't remember that specifically, but I do know we left around the 6:00

24 o'clock hour. I just remember I know it was dark.

25 Q Have you ever spoken to anybody who's told you that they were with the
 27

1 President at any point during January 6th while the attack was going on, and they told

2 you what he was saying or what they were doing during those meetings?

3 A No.

4 Q Let me stop to see if anybody who's on the call has any other questions.

5 I don't see anybody else raising their hand to speak.

6 I'll ask you at the end, Ms. Craddock. Do you recall or do you know whether you

7 have any text messages, emails, or chats that would still be in your, you know, in your

8 phone or on your computer from the day of January 6th?

9 A I'm sure there's something in my iCloud I have text messages from that day,

10 you know, letting people know when I'm coming home or going to work. That was

11 pretty typical for me.

12 Q So using your personal phone, because those are the sorts of things you

13 could do personally, not on your government phone, right? Yes?

14 A Yes. Sorry.

15 Q Yeah, and in terms of monitoring social media that day, was that on your

16 personal phone?

17 A Yes.

18 Q So I'll -- if -- would you be willing to look through and see if you have

19 anything related to just that day, messages or any chats or emails you would have sent

20 during the time of the attack? And you can talk to with Mr. Benson about it and I can

21 follow up, but --

22 A Do you mind if I speak -- yeah.

23 Mr. Benson. We'll take it under advisement.

24 Yeah, I'll come back.

25 But, otherwise, I think, Ms. Craddock, I told Mr. Benson we'd be efficient with your
 28

1 time. I don't have any further questions. I don't see that anybody else does.

2 So I want to say thank you again for taking the time to meet with you.

3 And, Dan, you let me know when you'd like to start our next appointment. We'd

4 have to click a different link but happy to get going as soon as you're ready.

5 Mr. Benson. Okay. Probably I'm guessing about 10 minutes or so.

6 That sounds good.

7 All right. Thank you both.

8 Mr. Benson. Should I email you when we're ready?

9 - That works. I'll log in and be ready to go when you're ready.

10 Mr. Benson. You'll send me the new link?

11 It's in the email I sent yesterday. It's just the second link.

12 Mr. Benson. Got it. Thank you.

13 - Take care, both.

14 [Whereupon, at 2:45 p.m., the interview was concluded.]

 29

1 Certificate of Deponent/Interviewee

4 I have read the foregoing _ _ pages, which contain the correct transcript of the

5 answers made by me to the questions therein recorded.

10 Witness Name

11

12

13

14 Date

15